Rumor: Xbox 360's defect rate was as high as 68%
by Dustin Burg 
{ Sep 8th 2008 at 11:45AM }
Again, this is all rumor seeing that Microsoft would never admit to such knowledge or such high defective rate numbers, but let's say they knew that 68% of all their consoles had a potential for failure. If so, shame on them, but we think they learned their lesson.
[Via Eurogamer]
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
Gamertag: GOPAL892005 @ Sep 8th 2008 11:53AM
if the console was to have a good chance of beating the PS3, this couldnt have really been avoided - even if the fault was spotted months before launch.
Devin @ Sep 8th 2008 12:35PM
Microsoft's strategy was to debut their console first, no matter what the cost. It made sense. They had to. Xbox was a failed attempt, though admirable and MS knew consumers were ready for another console and that Sony didn't cater to the consumers they were aiming for. IMHO, I don't know how a product with such a bad failure rate (causing such an inconvenience) can remain so respected (Best Console: Ghporia 2007/2008) in the gaming industry. Either way, I tip my hat to MS for actually extending the warranty 3 years for RRoD consoles, but they still didn't extend the warranty for failed GPU's and faulty DVD-ROMs which were also major issues that forced my friend to shell out $100 to ship/repair his 360.
dunnypop @ Sep 8th 2008 12:47PM
it's really funny on how the 360 has become very popular with the horrible failure rate.
I've known people who had to return/exchange their system (up to 9 times) and they still use the 360.
If M$ spent the extra money to QA their system, it would have saved them $4 billion in repairs.
Devin @ Sep 8th 2008 12:59PM
@dunnypop
Yes, that is true, they would've saved a lot of money, but they also gained a large portion of marketshare purely by being first, not by competing hand-and-hand with the competition; that would have been much more difficult and probably wouldn't have yielded the same (or better) result that we see today.
joeybeast @ Sep 8th 2008 1:28PM
Devin,
It's not like MS had a freaking choice.
I wouldn't have bought one if there's no such warranty.
Doug @ Sep 8th 2008 11:52AM
I wonder how much that (alleged) 68% failure rate has gone down in the past year.
My friend's HDMI 20gb 360 from last year RRoD'd last month. This is the model with the 2nd heat-sink, the same architecture as the Elites.
He did keep it in an entertainment center. The lesson seems to be, any 360 can still RRoD.
Dron @ Sep 8th 2008 1:46PM
Does that pic look like boobies to anyone else?
Insidious @ Sep 8th 2008 1:49PM
I guess I am a sucker, as that fellow said, there are some fellows that are on their 9th and still use it.
My second 360 just failed yesterday. I had been lucky...my probably high quality refurbished second 360 (of which the memory card slot came missing, along with the little flap covering the usb ports on the front) had given me the red rings several times, yet a simple restart would buy me a little more time. Though, that bought time was semi-lethal, as this "ominously lame riddling whatever" will warn...
As I hoped and (almost) prayed the mean mean red screen would be cast astray; my "generously extended" warranty from Billy "boy" Gates was withering away. Now, the friendly Indian customer rep says I must pay. She says "no a worry"! With 3rd 360 comes extra year of warranty, which will shall save the day!"
So, after I threatened to switch to PS3 or some other well made console (like that gay weeeeee!!!!), she says I get special discount on my repair rate, 25% off the usual $99. I love it! Wow, whadda deal! I get my third 360, it works for that one year its covered, then what!? Time for numero 4.
The reason I am a sucker and those fellas on number 9 is simple. I have invested at least $800 on this faulty device in the form of games and accessories, not to mention my two HDTVs I bought when they were much more expensive than today's "HDTVs"(which are really now just standard definition, "HD" annoys me now;but they were HD when I got 'em, b/c few others had them!) Keep in mind I'ma poor old college student.
So what am I and the other suckers to do!? Not pay the 25% special discount for bluffing to abandon the 360!? Lose all that money I spent on the games and accessories!? I'm hooked, just like the others. Even though I consider the 360 to now be pretty much completely outdated, I still enjoy watching my collection of downloaded documentaries worth over $100 (I told you I'ma sucker!) And I was looking forward to Fallout 3 as one of the last games I'll buy for this system.
Unfortunately, the 360 is overall the best console in my opinion this generation. Its hardware sucks, but the software rules in terms of consoles. The fact developers prioritize this system over PS3 doesn't hurt either...The fact I have games of which I enjoy and maintain not one, but TWO Xbox Live accounts keeps me on the hook (I really am a sucker now,huh!?).
The 360 is flawed beauty. As all beauty is expensive (especially the kind that talks and spends all your hard earned cash on shoes, f*ckin shoes!), I guess I'll pay. I'm sure the failure rate was much higher than 68% to chime in on that!
Rumble @ Sep 8th 2008 8:49PM
@ Dron:
Dammit. Now it does.
MattP @ Sep 8th 2008 11:57AM
This is a bit of a sloppy interpretation of the article. What it was talking about was manufacturing yield - 68 of every 100 units was determined to be defective at the factory. Those machines didn't get shipped out to be sold. A low yield like that is common and nothing to be ashamed about as it doesn't affect customers. The real problem, as indicated in the article, is that poor testing standards meant that many of the other 32 machines - those that tested as "good" - ended up failing.
Edog @ Sep 8th 2008 12:57PM
MattP - "A low yield like that is common and nothing to be ashamed about as it doesn't affect customers."
What?? Dude! You don't know what your talking about!
I work in R&D for portable devices and a 68% failure rate from manufacturing yield when a product is in full swing is unacceptable. In the Research and Development stage a 68% failure rate from the manufacture is acceptable- you got to work out the kinks. But when a product is sent to China after we design a final working product, and you get a result as M$ did, it only suggest one thing...the product is not ready for prime time. M$ knew that they had a stinker out of the gate and that the 360 wasn't a solid product, yet. This DOES affect the customer, because they received goods that weren't ready for prime time and could potentially fail. 70% of M$ money was being thrown out the window and the only reason they did this was to get a jump on market share which in turn would make-up for the 70% loss in production. M$ revised the warranty only after it was painfully obvious that the customer failure rate was very high so that they can avoid a class action suit which in turn would cost more then the billion spent on the revised warranty.
P.S.
I hate M$, but I love my 360.
So please M$ don't be this greedy in the future. There is only so much this jilted lover can take.
MattP @ Sep 8th 2008 2:17PM
My point is that a relatively low yield does not necessarily reflect on the quality of the product actually being sold to the customer and that the summary of the article incorrectly implies that the defect rate of shipped units was equivalent to the detected defect rate off the line. 68% is substantially higher than even the highest estimates for the actual defect rate of shipped units.
B3S7Y @ Sep 8th 2008 1:40PM
I got the RROD on Saturday, now have to wait 3 weeks!!! It did last two years though. Not Good enough!!
TORO @ Sep 8th 2008 12:43PM
Don't worry it took a little more than a week for mine to get back, they sent a replacement super fast!
gnik eltrut @ Sep 8th 2008 12:04PM
c'mon that seems VERY low! Everyone I know has RROD. I think it is VERY close to 100%!
Brian @ Sep 8th 2008 12:16PM
You don't know everyone in the world which has a 360 so don't comment on the number.
Neon Jebus @ Sep 8th 2008 1:16PM
Just as an example, I own two systems. I have a Premium I purchased about a year after launch and have since given to my girlfriend. I also have an Elite just now hitting about a year old.
Both systems have never had a system. Thinking of the people I know with the system and those that had a failed system, 68% is about spot on.
joeybeast @ Sep 8th 2008 12:06PM
The shit we put up with as fanboy.
I DeX I @ Sep 8th 2008 12:10PM
I'm on my forth box. This one has been fine for almost a year now. Freezes up every once in a while. Lately with Madden '09.
Trunas @ Sep 8th 2008 12:59PM
It might just be madden and not your system if it only freezes on this game. Reason I say that is because if you go to EA's website they clearly have admitted that the game freezes up during numerous times throughout the game and that they were releasing a patch soon. Hope its that and not your system.........good luck.
chojin @ Sep 8th 2008 12:13PM
just today i got my 2nd ROD - kinda sucks balls... now i have to wait just like that other guy ontop of me....
Edboy @ Sep 8th 2008 12:15PM
the Freudian slips here never cease to amuse me.
Edog @ Sep 8th 2008 1:06PM
Edboy. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar. And sometimes sucking balls just means terrible.
anthonyjh @ Sep 8th 2008 1:23PM
You don't know what a Freudian slip is, do you? This was just shorthand and bad grammar.
RagingStormX @ Sep 8th 2008 2:43PM
lmao.....just as Edboy pointed out....if you only know what you are completely saying there buddy. You might want to read your comment before you finally post it ;)
Viridium @ Sep 8th 2008 2:48PM
Edog/anthonyjh - I think Edboy's comment was more referring to chojin having more than one guy on top of him - having to clarify by saying "the *other* guy ontop [sic] of me.".
Dunno about you guys, but ain't EVAR no dudes on top 'o ME! On the bottom neither. No way, no how, no dudes.
Edog @ Sep 8th 2008 3:12PM
Viridium-good point. I totally missed that. My brain is so not there. Not that there is anything wrong with that. Live and let live! That's how we are going to avoid blowing each other up in the next 200 years.
Stupendous52 @ Sep 8th 2008 12:12PM
I believe I have had to send back FOUR consoles in my day. Luckily I've had my newest console for over a year with no problems (knock on wood).
Brian @ Sep 8th 2008 12:17PM
I've had my 360 since April the 28th, Never had a RROD yet.
Brian @ Sep 8th 2008 12:19PM
Well i do have a falcon which comes with a add-on heatsink, I've cutted out the metal mesh and bumped the fans up to 12v
sburko @ Sep 8th 2008 12:28PM
Still have a launch box going strong nearly 3 years. I keep it in an entertainment center with hardly any air flow, so I feel like I'm on the razors edge.
Ghoti @ Sep 8th 2008 12:30PM
Guess I'm lucky ... I have a launch pro system with the 20gb HD, pretty heavily used ... No RROD or other issues
Pete @ Sep 8th 2008 12:35PM
I'm on my 4th console. I gave up and went to the PS3 but decided last month to pick up an Elite system. I love the 360 but if this one goes belly up I'm done with Microsoft. I really should not have given them a 4th chance I just love the system so much.
Devin @ Sep 8th 2008 12:37PM
By "failed attempt" I mean "failed [to make a profit]"
According to Forbes Magazine, MS lost $4 Billion on the console.
Devin @ Sep 8th 2008 12:40PM
I agree, the console is great, but it's hard to support MS when the box continues failing and at such large numbers....
Sean @ Sep 8th 2008 12:51PM
Well what else are we meant to do? I've recently purchased a PS3 and beyond Uncharted there's really nothing to bother playing. I only bought it for Blu-Ray tbh! Great for watching media as it's much quieter, but the games library is woeful at present and most of my gaming is still carried out on Xbox Live.
Trunas @ Sep 8th 2008 12:42PM
I hope they don't dissappoint consumers with the next console......I myself have had no problems. I just sold my launch system a few weeks ago to a friend and bought an elite (when on sale at dell). The 360 is a great system for online play and gives you the feeling of always being connected to the gaming community (even more so when the new dashboard comes out). Not a sony fan but you can never count sony out of the picture!
chubytuby @ Sep 8th 2008 12:43PM
Are you guys really unlucky or do you treat your electronics like crap? The number of consoles you went through are ridiculous.
PS3 Fanboy: ''OMGAWDZ I went through liek 12 360 consoles. It sucks lulz.''
My first 360 feels like it can last years. It gets warm after 6 hours of playing but even my friend's PS3 feels like that.
Tony @ Sep 8th 2008 12:57PM
Listen, I used to sit around and say the same thing. Every single person I know at this point has had the RROD at some point. I've had it twice now and I couldn't take better care of the thing.
Sometimes user fault is to blame. It's not the case here. And even if it was, wouldn't it still be odd that it's THIS common? Putting these numbers together simply invalidates the idea that people not taking care of these things is even near the top of the list of problems.
You're lucky. I thought I was too. It took me quite a while to get the RROD, but it happens to anyone.
Chester @ Sep 8th 2008 12:53PM
I think this really says more about Sony then anything. With the 360's huge failure rate, it still seems to be the best console out. Or at least IMO! And I have all 3 systems.
Chester @ Sep 8th 2008 1:05PM
and if thats confusing, i mean the 360 is still the best system on the market!
Tony @ Sep 8th 2008 12:55PM
I like the little image for this post.
Shawn @ Sep 8th 2008 1:04PM
Bought my 360, an Elite, in February last year... RROD 3 weeks ago. Didn't even last 6 months. When I took it to the UPS store the girl said they send back a couple every week.
geekinabox @ Sep 8th 2008 1:29PM
My launch-day 360 is still going strong, but ~68% very nearly corresponds to the failure rate amongst my group of my 40-50 co-workers who also have owned one.
Devin @ Sep 8th 2008 1:06PM
Ok, let's be fair and leave 3rd party games out of this (since practially any 3rd party game since November of 2007 has been out for both0 and leave it up to 1st party titlers.
What 1st party titles do you own on 360?
What 1st party titles do you own on PS3?
We'll go from there.
Devin @ Sep 8th 2008 1:07PM
Sean,
Let's be fair and leave 3rd party games out of this (since practially any 3rd party game since November of 2007 has been out for both0 and leave it up to 1st party titlers.
What 1st party titles do you own on 360?
What 1st party titles do you own on PS3?
We'll go from there.
Mark @ Sep 8th 2008 1:19PM
I know that's suppose to be a frowny face... but is it just me or does that picture look like glowing red boobs?
Chester @ Sep 8th 2008 1:26PM
I think that's just you!
You might be a sex addict, it's an epidemic! LOL!
AJ @ Sep 8th 2008 1:22PM
Dustin, you need to re-read the article. You kinda misunderstood what the author was saying. You make it sound like, MS knew 68% of the 360's hitting the market would fail. That is not what the article says. I'm not saying that that might not be the case. I'm just saying that itis not what the article says. The article says that the yeild in the factory was at a 68% fail rate and they DID NOT make it to market. Note the whole part of the story about the Boneyard of 360's that never made it to market. I'm sure the failure rate of launch 360's is at least as high as 68% and that all the fault lies with MS, but this post is a poor interpretation of the article in question.
j.howlett @ Sep 8th 2008 1:37PM
this is why i'm still waiting, or at least part of it. when the price goes down some more and the build quality is better i want to pick one up for the handful of exclusive games and a few xbla titles